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Darkesia

New Theme Chatter

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I really don't think any of the themes speak to me.  I kind of like the laid back beach vision of TWP that I have always had.  Tahiti is how I always imagined TWP.  Not an imperial dynasty or kingdom. 

The idea of changing the flag seems...unTWP like.  The traditional setting sunburst is iconic and has been the TWP banner for....a really long time.  

Furthermore, I haven't seen a compelling reason to change it.

I guess what really seems...odd to me is if it is done through the hall of nations.  Then we will be voting on a theme change for the entire region with like 15 people voting... I understand the concept of Delegate supremacy and all.  But I think that this is going a little far.

I vote for tradition!

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It was my initial intention to have all of the residents in TWP vote on the theme, but after many discussions, we decided that the citizens are the most active residents and they should be the ones making the decision.

Several other themes other than the three presented were also considered, but we thought these offered the greatest opportunity for advancement and recognition, while still reflecting some of the key elements of the region.

I think all three themes are terrific!

Many thanks to Kawaii, Ark and OT for the work they put into developing these!

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A lot of hard work was put forth by OT and Ark, and they've really blew me away. I feel like I won't be able to compete with them haha! :lol: Nevertheless, I'm glad to have had a chance to pitch in. It's really nice to be able to change it up a bit. You run with the same thing for too long, it loses its luster with too many people. I have full faith that this will help garner more activity and get us more citizen applications.

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I've always enjoyed the laid-back theme (or lack of such) in TWP as well, and I respect the opinion of those who wish to uphold it. But having the theme change generates some excitement, and having a set theme in general incites interest in newcomers. 

I'm thinking back to when TWPAF unveiled the new pirate theme. Before Altino took over, we lacked a clear theme there; closest thing we had was the omnipresent anime and pinkness. When the pirate theme was unveiled, even our existing members renewed their interest and got more involved. Alti complimented this with effective recruitment drives, and TWPAF was in better shape than it had been in a while, with new stars rising through the ranks.

By embracing a new theme, any theme, we would have a clearer direction and a way to engage newcomers. Have to remember that most new NS players come from my generation, and we're famously bad at staying interested for long. We need to give them a reason to be interested.

</rambling>

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The guardianship and cabinet have considered the pros and cons of a theme change at every step of the way. We knew that some people would be iffy about stepping away from "traditional" TWP. We want you to know that what you came to and stayed in TWP for, whether it's relaxation, a career, or just a place to enjoy some snark, a theme change won't affect your ability to do that. I personally love all the proposed themes and I can't wait to see how the Hall votes. As far as changing the flag, one of the few instructions Halo explicitly gave us was to make the flag still reflective of TWP's current flag design, either through the color scheme or the sunburst. The flag will always feel like TWP regardless. The reason we settled on the Hall was covered by Halo, but I'd also like to bring up that having the entire region vote on a theme doesn't make all that much sense when most of the nations that would be voting are only gameside, which is 1/3rd of the areas the theme would actually affect (the other two being discord and forum obviously). I understand the traditionalist stance, of course, but sometimes it's okay to step away from tradition, and take a leap in the hope that the region will be better for it. I am very confident that this theme change will do nothing except provide another fun aspect to TWP and make the region a better place for a variety of player personalities to be in. 

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Anything that drives healthy activity is a good thing IMHO.  I see nothing wrong with an attempt to give the region a cultural theme and I applaud the creative work being done by the region's residents.

That said.  Can we get an option for an in-game theme that doesn't involve memorizing new titles, please?  Can the Delegate and Ministers still have titles that clearly state what they do?  the one thing that really irks me about the themed regions is the crazy titles everyone has.  I need a glossary to figure out who has what job in Osiris for example.  

 

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1 minute ago, Darkesia said:

That said.  Can we get an option for an in-game theme that doesn't involve memorizing new titles, please?  Can the Delegate and Ministers still have titles that clearly state what they do?  the one thing that really irks me about the themed regions is the crazy titles everyone has.  I need a glossary to figure out who has what job in Osiris for example.  

 

Aside from the Hall of Peers, I think most of the titles will be pretty straightforward. I’m sure we could work around anything overly obscure gameside at least, though. 

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That makes sense, Dark.

I think the Ministers would retain their current titles, but even if something is added I agree wholeheartedly that they should retain titles that easily inform as to what they do.

 

ninjaed ... :P

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I agree with Dark trying to figure out who the FA minister is or the delegate is annoying when they all have obscure or confusing names. This being said I'm all for a theme change but I don't want to change the traditional laid back nature, I personally like it because it offers a break from my hectic RL. If I had a preference it would be the Imperial Russian theme I but I applaud everyone for the hard work and the huge amount of creativity in the ideas. 

 

my one thought or Idea would probably be a more organized discord or forum RP, but that take a lot of work and effort so it may not be plausible. 

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Hmmmm.

My first impression:  Any theme needs to incorporate traditional TWP.

My second impression:  Change can be good, and a theme can be a rallying point. But change for the sake of change is useless.

*reads other thread*

My third impression:  These theme proposals don't speak to me. There's nothing wrong with them. But I don't want to live in a Russia or China themed region, I want to live in The West Pacific which has nothing to do with those.

Be Original, be TWP.

A pirate theme works.....it's not nationality/location specific. An imperial theme works....if it's not RL nation based...

TWP should be TWP themed.

My fourth impression:  None of my prior impressions matter.

1 hour ago, Ark said:

The reason we settled on the Hall was covered by Halo, but I'd also like to bring up that having the entire region vote on a theme doesn't make all that much sense when most of the nations that would be voting are only gameside,

Doesn't the government represent all those gameside nations too? 

I refuse to sign an oath to prove I'm active in a region. So my opinion has no weight.

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1 hour ago, Westwind said:

My third impression:  These theme proposals don't speak to me. There's nothing wrong with them. But I don't want to live in a Russia or China themed region, I want to live in The West Pacific which has nothing to do with those.

It won’t be such an intense theme change as to change our culture or how we operate to match that of the country we’re themed after. I understand your point though. Halo specifically chose these theme options because they have coastlines along the western Pacific Ocean, however, so they do have a tangential connection. 

1 hour ago, Westwind said:

A pirate theme works.....it's not nationality/location specific. An imperial theme works....if it's not RL nation based...

TWP should be TWP themed.

TWPAF will be keeping its pirate theme, it’s always been relatively independent when it comes to theming/stylization as long as I’ve been around. TWP proper, however, is neither pirate-themed nor Tahiti-themed like badger suggested. It is, like most of the feeders, theme-less with a general feel of a theme or culture that evolved over time. Which is something we took note of. Does TWP *need* a theme like UCRs or Sinkers? No, it doesn’t. And this theme change is disimilar to those for some very important reasons. Primarily, UCRs and Sinkers base their entire region and culture off of their themes. We do not. We are taking TWP’s existing culture and adding to it with the theme (which is almost entirely cosmetic aside from the Hall of Peers addition) that the delegate and region have agreed upon. 

 

1 hour ago, Westwind said:

My fourth impression:  None of my prior impressions matter.

Doesn't the government represent all those gameside nations too? 

I refuse to sign an oath to prove I'm active in a region. So my opinion has no weight.

Your impressions absolutely matter, Westwind, as do those of the nations gameside. However, I can think of no more secure way to vote for a theme than on the forums. I disapprove of sacrificing that security by holding a gameside poll, where the options are either WA nations (TWPAF and non-WA citizens can’t vote), “natives” (totally arbitrary residency requirement IIRC), or everyone (meaning that any other region could very well spam our poll and pick our theme for us). I do however, think it would be pertinent to advertise the theme change to the region so that they are at least aware that a theme change vote is occurring. As far as your comment about an oath, I don’t really know what to do about that. The existence of a citizenship oath isn’t up to me, nor do I think it’s particularly binding or restrictive. 

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One point that I made in my original post that has also been reflected by Ark, I want to stress.

No theme will eliminate the unique TWP-ness of our region. We will not be slavishly following one of these themes.

They will be a framework which we will alter to suit the needs of our residents and the character of our region.

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One of the reasons TWPAF benefited from its pirate theme was because that theme is well suited to West Pacifican culture. I'm all for a rebranding of TWP, as I've made plenty clear before, but making something it other than TWP doesn't make any sense. There's no reason we should be taking things from RL cultures that aren't ours when we have a perfectly good one right here in TWP. The theme should reflect TWP, not the other way around.

One can say that a new theme won't affect our culture, except it undoubtedly will. If done correctly, all mentions of TWP in government, documentation, and conversation would include the new language, and of the active members it will please some, do nothing to others, and irritate others. New nations will feel its influence even more strongly, as they wouldn't know anything else. Not to mention, if a theme either doesn't change or doesn't reflect the culture, then what's the point? People could just ignore it and all of this effort and discussion would be for naught.

To that extent, I'm not in favor of any of the themes presented, and I think we have a lot more to gain from expanding TWPAF's pirate theme for the rest of the region. It's unique, easy to understand, and meshes well with TWP's culture. On the whole I prefer when things are discussed as a region and not presented to us after closed door discussions.

Were I forced to choose from the three, however, Kawaii's Shogunate Japan theme seemed the best. Being open ended and more in favor of a reskin as opposed to something larger makes it easier to adapt to our needs. Plus it includes the only flag of the bunch that was interesting to me.

Overall, a TWP theme is the best theme.

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I changed themes two or three times during my Delegacy. We started out sort of Dune based with the Laandstrad for the Assembly. But no one could remember how to spell it. *chuckles* Later went to the Sacred Order of The West Pacific and The West Pacific Imperium.  Policies stayed the same, graphics stayed the same. The theme is just a costume you put on :P 

In the end, it's delegate's choice IMO. I mearly added to titles for my themes, so a Minister became Holy Minister and a Guardian became a Cardinal Guardian.

In Equilism we went through a period when we changed the theme with each government. By the time they'd gotten to a Game of Thrones theme, they lost me as I didn't know anything about it (still don't) - so was all meaningless to me.  Houses, titles, all irrelevant and confusing to me. 

I like the dragon imagery in the graphics proposal. You can tie that to TWP having had two Delegates associated with Dragons.  You could take the Eagle and Crossbones flag and replace the Eagle with a Dragon.

I gotta admit, I haven't been fond of TWPAF flags for some time.

I think folks are too resistant to making use of the ingame polling. This would still be somewhat restrictive, but it would cast a wider net than the forum and still would be secure:  Set the poll to both Native and Large Nation - it will prevent nations from other regions jumping in to vote, and prevent new founded nations from voting. (A nation would have to be about 6 months old to vote...a nation voting age requirement based on game mechanics).

You could even form a bi-cameral legislature: ingame based on those polling rules (House), and Hall of Peers voting (Senate), Delegate has veto authority.

Although, having a bi-cameral legislature is what got TWP into trouble before. The Senate becomes and exclusionary old boys club that eventually goes inactive and blocks the Delegate (I've seen this movie before)

1 hour ago, Ark said:

As far as your comment about an oath, I don’t really know what to do about that.

*chuckles*  Nothing.  I've championed more open citizenship, and removed citizenship oaths when I was delegate. It was never a problem. I haven't been a TWP citizen since oaths were reintroduced. So I'm just being me.   :P  

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More old Graphics....I'll spoiler them to spare the thread.


 

Spoiler

 

Yes, TWP and Dragons...

agp02.jpg

 

 

There was this old TWP Pirates flag...

twp_rum.jpg

 

I predominantly used this regional flag during my delegacy:

twp_flag_1.jpg

 

Let's see, what else....

The Tweedy Flags of Yy4u's Delegacy:

tweedy_behind_flag.jpg

Another:

twp_tweed.png

 

The New West Pacfic Order

nwpo.jpg

 

TWP Ministry of State Security:

MoSS_seal.jpg

 

The West Pacific Imperium:

imperium3.jpg

 

TWP Flag Flying in the wind

TheWestPacificFlag_gif.gif

 

Once upon a time this flag used to follow TWPAF into battle:

send_booze.jpg

 

Ah...finally found it....the complete Klingon Pirate Flag of TWP  (BTW, "Klingon Pirates" was suppose to be an insult - TSP gave us that nickname. We embraced it instead.)

pirate_klingon.jpg

 

The Darkesian TWP/Gatesville Hybrid Flag

darkesia_gvtwp.jpg

 

And then, after bringing global peace, TWP, lead by All Good People was faced with the final nation of resistance, lead by Donald Rumsfeld.
(The road to global NS peace was strewn with thousands of bodies of banjected nations)

AGP1a_twp.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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That is such a treat, Westwind! Whoa! TWP's history is one of my favorites to hear about. Always do silly and fun. :) TWP has always been a region that made things their own, I love it. Also I finally found the other thread people were talking in. xD I just commented on the legislation one. My vote was for Imperialist China. Though now I'm sad no one tried to enforce Klingon TWP, I definitely would have voted for that instead. 

 

I'm really sad to see some of these older TWP folks discouraging this newer generation from making things their own and investing in a vision for TWP on their terms! Badger sees TWP as a laid back beach vibe, but clearly that's not what anyone was going for when TWP was a Klingon crazyland. Giving newer generations an opportunity to invest in their region is really important. If you're not going to grow with TWP, then it can't be the TWP that you envisioned forever. It has to be the TWP that reaches out to the people investing in it right now, y'know? I get the discomfort. But I feel like these new themes do definitely keep classic TWP elements in them - like the colors didn't go anywhere! - while letting the TWP of the present make their own mark on the region. They need a history too. :) 

 

Also I agree with Dark about confusing names and keeping them clear at least on Gameside. Regions with hard themes are great, but hard to decipher for FA purposes or for new people if they're not pretty well spelled out in like, RO titles or at least a Dispatch somewhere. 

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7 hours ago, WaRlorder said:

I agree with Dark trying to figure out who the FA minister is or the delegate is annoying when they all have obscure or confusing names. This being said I'm all for a theme change but I don't want to change the traditional laid back nature, I personally like it because it offers a break from my hectic RL. If I had a preference it would be the Imperial Russian theme I but I applaud everyone for the hard work and the huge amount of creativity in the ideas. 

 

my one thought or Idea would probably be a more organized discord or forum RP, but that take a lot of work and effort so it may not be plausible. 

I agree wholeheartedly about the names. It makes it a bit harder for me to fill out diplomatic reports on Osiris since the Viziers all have silly titles like "Sandwich Enforcer" on the Osiris region page. I can still figure out who's who by looking on their regional forum to find out their real titles (Vizier of Gameside Affairs, Sub-Vizier of Community Affairs, etc.), but it would be a nightmare for me if all of their real titles were, in fact, names like Sandwich Enforcer or Pebble. I can imagine there would be a lot of  confusion amongst members of our region if our gov officials' titles were "Czarveich" or "Kung" or "ChiangChun."

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