Elegarth

I agree that interest in the theme change has been more than for all other subjects that have come up for debate in recent times, which is great news.  The numbers still do not, in my opinion, come anywhere near to a mandate from the player community at large.  By denying them a say, even if it is an advisory one, seems to me to be overly restrictive and may result in feelings of having been ridden roughshod and ignored.
It is understood that much work has been done by yourself and the proponents of the shortlisted themes, and that by going to the populace may seem be be against your personal wishes/judgement.  However, I fail to see what the cogent argument(s) for not doing so is/are. Of course, the final path ahead is your's to chart, but if I were a player and knew that a theme change was in the offing I would love, nay expect, to be at least asked my views.  After all, without the players, what is the region's raison d'etre?
 

I think that this is a real positive idea that will help the chosen theme gain legitimacy in the region.
I agree that it feels like we are rushing into this when legit discussion is/was still taking place.
I am increasingly unsettled that the only people allowed to vote on the regional theme are Hall of Nations members.
It doesn't seem representative of the region.

I am! And welcome back to you too, sorry to hear about your mother-in-law. The whole region was thinking of you

I will always respect the Delegate's will, I'm just saying we should not pretend we are being fully open to the options. I'm ok with whatever result

57 replies during a 5 day discussion between about 9 players is not "a discussion at lenght" nor a "most people"
 
You have the right to do this, lets just not pretend it is a public driven thing when it isn't. I am all for making clear what is clear. 
 
You are merely taking the opinion of a few in something you already decided to go with, but there isn't any real option. Let's not fool ourselves. 
 
I do wonder, if you are so sure "most people" supports this, why didnt you take it to an in game poll, make it official, and add the no change option
 
That would have been the fire test to your supposed massive support. 

If you are going to do this by vote, why not add the option to REMAIN as we ARE? Would that be something you will be willing to do? Seems fair to me...

I must say this echoes what I mostly feel about it. I don't like gimmicks, as they are easy to derail and harder to maintain. We already have a laid back culture which is easy to go and learn, get used to, etc.

Furthermore, the themes proposes seem forced to me... Not natural or native... I'm not a fan.

I also vote for tradition tbh

I will always respect the Delegate's will, I'm just saying we should not pretend we are being fully open to the options. I'm ok with whatever result

I will always respect the Delegate's will, I'm just saying we should not pretend we are being fully open to the options. I'm ok with whatever result

57 replies during a 5 day discussion between about 9 players is not "a discussion at lenght" nor a "most people"
 
You have the right to do this, lets just not pretend it is a public driven thing when it isn't. I am all for making clear what is clear. 
 
You are merely taking the opinion of a few in something you already decided to go with, but there isn't any real option. Let's not fool ourselves. 
 
I do wonder, if you are so sure "most people" supports this, why didnt you take it to an in game poll, make it official, and add the no change option
 
That would have been the fire test to your supposed massive support. 

57 replies during a 5 day discussion between about 9 players is not "a discussion at lenght" nor a "most people"
 
You have the right to do this, lets just not pretend it is a public driven thing when it isn't. I am all for making clear what is clear. 
 
You are merely taking the opinion of a few in something you already decided to go with, but there isn't any real option. Let's not fool ourselves. 
 
I do wonder, if you are so sure "most people" supports this, why didnt you take it to an in game poll, make it official, and add the no change option
 
That would have been the fire test to your supposed massive support. 

I will always respect the Delegate's will, I'm just saying we should not pretend we are being fully open to the options. I'm ok with whatever result

From what I'm seeing, there's three main opinions: those in favor of one of the three presented themes, those in favor of a change, but not one of the themes presented, and those not in favor of a change. 
While it's Halo's perogative and I understand the reasoning, adding either a "Different Theme" and/or a "No Change" option would have soothed people's opinions and made them feel more included and valued. As we've seen here and other places, a community involved process doesn't mean all thousands of nations are involved, this thread alone has less than twenty different posters in it. Just because it may be a little more contentious and complicated doesn't make community involvement in decision making a bad idea.
Regardless of what happens, I have faith that Halo will make it work and we'll have a successful theme, even though the one that wins won't be everyone's first choice.

57 replies during a 5 day discussion between about 9 players is not "a discussion at lenght" nor a "most people"
 
You have the right to do this, lets just not pretend it is a public driven thing when it isn't. I am all for making clear what is clear. 
 
You are merely taking the opinion of a few in something you already decided to go with, but there isn't any real option. Let's not fool ourselves. 
 
I do wonder, if you are so sure "most people" supports this, why didnt you take it to an in game poll, make it official, and add the no change option
 
That would have been the fire test to your supposed massive support. 

I must say this echoes what I mostly feel about it. I don't like gimmicks, as they are easy to derail and harder to maintain. We already have a laid back culture which is easy to go and learn, get used to, etc.

Furthermore, the themes proposes seem forced to me... Not natural or native... I'm not a fan.

I also vote for tradition tbh

If you are going to do this by vote, why not add the option to REMAIN as we ARE? Would that be something you will be willing to do? Seems fair to me...

I have avoided publicly commenting on these changes because I wanted to let the process play itself out organically. However...
I understand Halo's reasons for trying a theme and I'm willing to give it a chance. As Westwind has shown, themes and ways of doing things can change over time. The Ele/Badger/Davelands/Neenee era of TWP was theme-less, maybe Halo will begin a themed era. Or not. If it doesn't work out it can easily be changed or removed.
I agree that it is 100% Halo's decision. He could wake up tomorrow and declare that we are now "TWP In Space" ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmI77ZBeJrQ ) and go forward with that theme. But it's a better thing that he is asking for all this input. Maybe, like Dark said, we are close to something really good. Maybe some flexibility is in order by all sides.
But, one thing that I am against is the decision to add the Peers based on the whim of the Delegate. This is exactly the type of thing we created the Hall of Nations for. Honestly, if the Delegate proposed a change like this and it was debated and voted on by the Hall, there is almost no chance of it failing, so why not let them do it? It's been almost a year since the Hall did anything of substance besides run elections. If you wanted to spur activity then that would be a great way to start.
And I agree with Badger that Westwind's graphics were an amazing look back into the past.

I changed themes two or three times during my Delegacy. We started out sort of Dune based with the Laandstrad for the Assembly. But no one could remember how to spell it. *chuckles* Later went to the Sacred Order of The West Pacific and The West Pacific Imperium.  Policies stayed the same, graphics stayed the same. The theme is just a costume you put on  
In the end, it's delegate's choice IMO. I mearly added to titles for my themes, so a Minister became Holy Minister and a Guardian became a Cardinal Guardian.
In Equilism we went through a period when we changed the theme with each government. By the time they'd gotten to a Game of Thrones theme, they lost me as I didn't know anything about it (still don't) - so was all meaningless to me.  Houses, titles, all irrelevant and confusing to me. 
I like the dragon imagery in the graphics proposal. You can tie that to TWP having had two Delegates associated with Dragons.  You could take the Eagle and Crossbones flag and replace the Eagle with a Dragon.
I gotta admit, I haven't been fond of TWPAF flags for some time.
I think folks are too resistant to making use of the ingame polling. This would still be somewhat restrictive, but it would cast a wider net than the forum and still would be secure:  Set the poll to both Native and Large Nation - it will prevent nations from other regions jumping in to vote, and prevent new founded nations from voting. (A nation would have to be about 6 months old to vote...a nation voting age requirement based on game mechanics).
You could even form a bi-cameral legislature: ingame based on those polling rules (House), and Hall of Peers voting (Senate), Delegate has veto authority.
Although, having a bi-cameral legislature is what got TWP into trouble before. The Senate becomes and exclusionary old boys club that eventually goes inactive and blocks the Delegate (I've seen this movie before)
*chuckles*  Nothing.  I've championed more open citizenship, and removed citizenship oaths when I was delegate. It was never a problem. I haven't been a TWP citizen since oaths were reintroduced. So I'm just being me.     

Hmmmm.
My first impression:  Any theme needs to incorporate traditional TWP.
My second impression:  Change can be good, and a theme can be a rallying point. But change for the sake of change is useless.
*reads other thread*
My third impression:  These theme proposals don't speak to me. There's nothing wrong with them. But I don't want to live in a Russia or China themed region, I want to live in The West Pacific which has nothing to do with those.
Be Original, be TWP.
A pirate theme works.....it's not nationality/location specific. An imperial theme works....if it's not RL nation based...
TWP should be TWP themed.
My fourth impression:  None of my prior impressions matter.
Doesn't the government represent all those gameside nations too? 
I refuse to sign an oath to prove I'm active in a region. So my opinion has no weight.

I must say this echoes what I mostly feel about it. I don't like gimmicks, as they are easy to derail and harder to maintain. We already have a laid back culture which is easy to go and learn, get used to, etc.

Furthermore, the themes proposes seem forced to me... Not natural or native... I'm not a fan.

I also vote for tradition tbh

Even if changes are good and cool. I cannot have an opinion yet of a change, by this moment I stand with @Big Bad Badger I vote for tradition. But if something good gets in the table work, then I will see if I can give suggestions or support change.
 

I really don't think any of the themes speak to me.  I kind of like the laid back beach vision of TWP that I have always had.  Tahiti is how I always imagined TWP.  Not an imperial dynasty or kingdom. 
The idea of changing the flag seems...unTWP like.  The traditional setting sunburst is iconic and has been the TWP banner for....a really long time.  
Furthermore, I haven't seen a compelling reason to change it.
I guess what really seems...odd to me is if it is done through the hall of nations.  Then we will be voting on a theme change for the entire region with like 15 people voting... I understand the concept of Delegate supremacy and all.  But I think that this is going a little far.
I vote for tradition!

I really liked the simplicity and TWPness of your design, so I had it in the back of my head as I was working on it. I tend to go overboard with detail so that helped tone it down a little.
Oh I remember those! Were you the one who made that FA logo? It looks really nice.

Never promised.

In the late 70's was editor of my high school newspaper, The Panther's Cry. I got the position from a competition with a fake newspaper layout...mine was the "Four Wings High Times" (one wing had been blown up by the South Wing Sweat Hogs, another wing had simply disappeared - I had fun with it).  Cut and paste layout of typewritten material, PC's were years away yet.
In 1979 I penned an article about the Iranian Revolution, the US Embassy was being held hostage at the time. I had to get clearance from the School Board to publish it, as it was considered a controversial topic. I got approval and it ran front page. It was a good article, covering Iranian history as well as the current events.
In the 80's I was editor of Christian Light Ministries newsletter, and the Kansas Avicultural Society Magazine. I had an online newsletter delivered to 35 countries in the 90's called Tales Across The Waters for fans of the German band Triumvirat. Was always surprised how large their fan base was in South America, Japan, and Korea. One subscriber/fan in Japan went to temple to have a blessing made for my daughter when she was born. I sponsored a couple 'cultural exchange' concerts in St. Louis in '99, folks we're asking for my autograph - I told them they were nuts. The band reunited and recorded a new album called "The Website Story" inspired by my work, but the record label went bankrupt and the album was never released. (I have the songs and planned artwork, but the band leader won't follow through further. But for a 2000 album, it sound alot like the 80's. Lead singer on that album is now with the Nervous Germans.)
At times I've thought about creating an online local news service, the local newspaper is terrible. Live citizen tips and reports would do better.